while I got your attention...you like your ergo shifters? is the thumb button easy to get to from the hoods and drops (seems a bit far back for the hoods to me)?

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Are you asking Kurt?

Submitted by X-topher on Tue, 2008-03-18 17:12.

'cause he was talking about his mountain bike, not his road bike. Or maybe you ARE referring to his road bike, in which case I am just making this confusing.

Now while I have YOUR attention: when is your next gap ride?

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.

Submitted by paul h on Tue, 2008-03-18 17:28.

I dunno, but we better hurry, b/c once I start messing with my road bike, it'll be out of commsion for a while[1].

How does next weekend sound?

[1]Getting respaced, new braze-ons, repainted, and the Kwisatz Haderach [2]drivetrain.

[2]OK, there's the Dune reference.

Oh yeah, I was talking about Kurt's Cinelli.

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Your water shall mix with

Submitted by Teh Black Hole on Tue, 2008-03-18 17:39.

Your water shall mix with our water.

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The thumb button isn't

Submitted by IndyFan on Tue, 2008-03-18 18:14.

The thumb button isn't perfectly arranged to downshift from the drops but it's not difficult. There are two ergo advantages that I like: the ability to dump a lot of (all) gears in one motion, and the button separates braking from shifting motion. (My Shimano gripes.)

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ergo shifters

Submitted by kurt on Wed, 2008-03-19 00:17.

Yeah, I do like the ergo shifters a lot. They are easy for me to reach from hoods and feel really solid and trustworthy. They are a bit tougher to reach in the drops. The big bonus is much cleaner cable routing. No weird cable sticking straight out the side of the shifter.

I have not done a great deal of road riding on any other type of shifter but from an ergonomic perspective, I really like the sram force idea. Its brilliant.

You are welcome to take the Cinelli for a spin any time - i believe you ride a 56 anyway right?

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.

Submitted by paul h on Wed, 2008-03-19 01:07.

Yeah, SRAM is really appealing to me too. The design is so clever. But, I don't like the idea of indexed front shifting and the fact that shifting down at all means pushing the lever fairly far might be an issue (but probably isn't)

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Paul

Submitted by Teh Black Hole on Tue, 2008-03-18 20:40.

I may have talked to you before about this... but is the reason you are doing this is the lack of cheaply had Campy touring type wheelsets?

it's complicated

Submitted by paul h on Tue, 2008-03-18 23:47.

I've wanted a new bike for a long time. I was set to get a Soma Smoothie ES and put SRAM Rival on it. I'd also want to get a new front wheel. I think at that point I looking to spend around 1600 on the total package.

Then I got to looking at other frames and saw the beautiful lugged Soma Speedster with it's matching fork. Ok, bump that to 1900.

THEN I started looking at the Gunnar Sport. Sure it's not as pretty, but it's made my American craftsfolk, not laborers in the far east. So bump it up to over 2000 bucks.

ÅND THEN I started really comparing the geometries, and they were all pretty much the same as my scratched/kinda rusty Trek 330, which is also a "sport touring" bike. I also noticed that this guy does some really snazzy work for about 225 bucks. Add some minor work from Tamara/Wildframe that I'd want done even if I got a new frame and then I've spent about 300 for a great frame that should have plenty of service life left in it.

I knew that no matter what, I didn't want Shimano shift levers. I've ridden them and prefer barcons or DT shifters to them. I don't like the way they feel and they're grossly over priced for something that could break in a year and ahalf and not be repairable. I also think it's ridiculous to index the shifting up front (the only beef with RIval).

I knew Campy Ergo was comfy and all, but I already had a nice Shimano/SRAM rear wheel, so I figured I'd stick with SRAM. But then I got to looking at 10spd consumables (chains/cassettes) and that shit's expensive. So sticking with my 9spd stuff and getting Veloce/Centaur (>200 bucks) plus a shiftmate and I've got what seems to be the best of both worlds. I can switch to 10spd if I want one day. I can get a triple crankset. And all this for about 1/3 of my cheapest previous option.

Now, I might still get the Smoothie ES b/c I'm kind of nervous about sinking money into the work on a frame that's already had a dropout replaced. And the paint plus the frame work isn't that much cheaper, but the color would be cooler.

Feel free to critique my thinking here. Also I think I'd want to paint the Trek that dark, burnt orange you see on a bunch of Vanillas.

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This all sounds reasonable.

Submitted by guerciotti on Wed, 2008-03-19 00:12.

This all sounds reasonable. Just a couple of data points.

Your point about shimano not be repairable is well taken. I know somebody getting a complete Centaur groupo for abit over $700 wholesale who got burned by shimano brifters. Just keep in mind that what Tom/Indyfan referenced about dumping your cassette in one fell swoop only applies to Record and Chorus, if thats even important to ya.

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RE Campy rebuildability:

Submitted by Dfunk on Wed, 2008-03-19 07:14.

RE Campy rebuildability: Consensus in my shop is that Shimano lasts about as long as riding/rebuilding campy into the ground without having to rebuild it. But maybe that's just the voice of lazy mechanics who don't want to rebuild your shit. I have no personal experience. YMMV.

Are you set on brifters? If you prefer barcons to brifters, new Shimano 9-speed barcons can be had very reasonably on ebay and such. I think both front and rear are selectable on the fly between friction and index. I know the rear is, the front may be friction only. I've been thinking about doing this myself but I'm lazy and don't feel like redoing cables and bar tape, even though I probably should in the near future.

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.

Submitted by paul h on Wed, 2008-03-19 10:28.

Right now, I can get the Campy levers for marginally more than Shimano 9spd barcons.

And yeah, I think I really want the brifters. I've been slumming in the downtube town long enough now. Quite frankly, DTs and to a lesser extent, barcons, are hard to reach on a really challenging climb (not the hills you find in the metro ATL area).

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"DTs and to a lesser extent,

Submitted by Dfunk on Wed, 2008-03-19 11:42.

"DTs and to a lesser extent, barcons, are hard to reach on a really challenging climb..."

How so? Do you climb on the tops/hoods? If so, I could see reaching from the hoods to the bar ends or downtube being problematic. Funnily, I usually climb most comfortably from the drops on my road bike, putting my barcons in easy reach. This may have to do with my riding an oversized frame and/or having yet to experience a 6-gap-type climb.

One final note: I don't know what you already know, but I'm often told that brifters are way more sensitive than DT's/barcons. I understand that Bad Things happen if your cable snaps inside the shifter. Use a gentle touch and change out worn cables sooner rather than later to minimize headaches. Come to think of it, that's probably good advice for any cable system on a bike.

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getting to the DT shifter

Submitted by paul h on Wed, 2008-03-19 11:55.

getting to the DT shifter while out of the saddle is a little tricky and there's more important things to worry about on a long climb (like impending 45 mph descents)

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Just my 2 cents worth

Submitted by Jeff on Wed, 2008-03-19 13:43.

My Shimano Ultegra 9 speed brifters have over 12,000 miles (commuting, rain, snow, wind and shine) on them and seem to be shifting fine. I think the story for happy brifters is to not let dirt get into the workings--and if you do, very generous use of WD40 to wash out the crud. YMMV

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Leper.

this might help

thanks

This may help you Paul:

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I have never traveled the dark forrests of mythical Shimagnolo

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